Thursday, August 17, 2006

The Proof of God (Part Four - Save the Best for Last)

Because we cannot see God physically does not mean that it is impossible to prove His existence.
Just like when a person said they had a dream and described the dream as such and such, it is impossible for anyone else other than the person who had the dream (or claimed that they had the dream) to physically prove it. In this case, they have to have trust in the person that what they claim they have dreamt did really occur in their dream.

So the lack of actually seeing the tangible representation of something does not mean it is impossible to improve. Surely, the person who had the dream knows without a doubt that their dreamt of what they dreamt, even if OTHER people cannot see it. Just like we cannot see God does not mean that it is impossible to prove His existence via just physically seeing Him.

That is why we need to focus on arguments that deal with creation or existence of things to prove or “refute” the existence of God.


At 5:14 PM, Blogger Al-Hajeji said...

aslamu alaykum...

Inshah'Allah many would read this, especially non muslims.

At 12:08 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

salam alaikum ahki,

ma shalalh very good post, keep it up please. wa salam alaikum


At 11:59 AM, Anonymous U. Hanif said...

Just a comment on your reasoning; it’s not the best argument. :-) You see, if you’ve studied psychology you probably learned about the different stages of sleep; and the brain patterns of these stages. The point is, yeah we can’t know what the person is dreaming, but we CAN observe the proofs of his sleep (REM Stage 5). At that stage the person is in his deepest sleep, and the body is in paralysis, but the person will exhibit involuntary twitches in the limbs. The paralysis is the body’s mechanism which prevents the person from acting out his dreams.

So anyways, the point is that this was all researched, measured, and observed in the 1950s. The analogy (if I may call it one) of the dream and Allah is flawed for that very reason. You see, Allah is Al-Batin, the Hidden One. Completely hidden from the senses. It’s as if there is a veil or a wall in between Allah and the creation. Remember, 006.103 No vision can grasp Him, but His grasp is over all vision: He is above all comprehension, yet is acquainted with all things.
So you see, trying to use the Socratic method to attempt to prove the existence of Allah is futile; you cannot observe Allah with the five senses.

Guidance, the realization that one has a Creator, will come from Allah. Only Allah will cause a person to come near Him. Of course there are signs, as Allah says in Surah Al- Imran, 003.190
Behold! in the creation of the heavens and the earth, and the alternation of night and day,- there are indeed Signs for men of understanding,-. But again, guidance is only open to the sincere ones. As Allah says again and again in different parts of the Quran, “verily Allah does not guide the oppressors (wrong-doers). And what bigger oppression is the oppression of self, when a person refuses to believe? Allah will guide whom He wills, we shouldn’t focus on trying to MAKE people believe through philosophical/scientific principles, guidance comes from Allah alone. Moreover, to do so, we admit that there may be a possibility Allah does not exist (Astaghfarullahilazeem). The atheists have the premise about the non-exstence of a supernatural being, and they try to get believers to argue from that starting point by telling us to use scientific/philosophical means. There are such proofs, but the end result of such debates will usually be standstills; otherwise we’d have people joining Islam by the masses, you get what I mean?

PS. I didn’t intend to argue, or seem long-winded. I just happened to browse through your blog and saw the entry about the dream, so I wanted to reply. No offense or insult was meant :-)


At 12:04 PM, Blogger Mahdi Ahmad said...

As-salaamu `alaikum U. Hanif,

I am not sure you understood my argument. If you said you dreamt of you on the beach surfing, I can never see that dream of you on the beach surfing. Sure, I can observe your bodily movements while you were asleep and dreaming but that's it; I cannot see the actual dream itself.

Right now, none of us can "physically" see Allah with any of our five senses. So your point proves my argument: not sensing something does not make it non-existent.

At 12:12 PM, Anonymous U. Hanif said...

Well you see, what the person dreams is really besides the point; the fact is that he HAS dreamed, and it has been measured. We can't say the same about Allah.

May Allah forgive me if I sound heretical, I'm just thinking trying to see if the argument you have can be improved :)

At 1:47 PM, Blogger Abu Ismael al-Beirawi said...

Assalam wa alaikum

Check out my article which is related this subject on my blog:

Hope you find it useful


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